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Rules. Retrospectively.

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1 Rules. Retrospectively. on Wed Feb 23, 2011 2:42 am

STAND UP: MOVE ACTION
✦ Unoccupied Space: If your space is not occupied by
another creature, you stand up where you are.
✦ Occupied Space: If your space is occupied by
another creature, you can shift 1 square, as part of
this move action, to stand up in an adjacent unoccupied
space. If your space and all adjacent squares are
occupied by other creatures, you can’t stand up.

So... we can occupy the space of a fallen companion or creature actually.

REGENERATION
✦ Heal Each Turn: If you have regeneration and at
least 1 hit point, you regain a specified number of
hit points at the start of your turn. If your current hit
point total is 0 or lower, you do not regain hit points
through regeneration.

So we cannot regen from 0hp to 5hp from the alter. HAHA!

FORCED MOVEMENT
✦ Line of Effect: You must have line of effect to any
square you pull, push, or slide a creature into.
✦ Distance in Squares: The power you’re using specifies
how many squares you can move a target. You
can choose to move the target fewer squares or not
to move it at all. You can’t move the target vertically.

No flying slides, i guess.

✦ Catching Yourself: If a power or a bull rush (page
287) forces you over a precipice or into a pit, you can
immediately make a saving throw to avoid going over
the edge. This saving throw works just like a normal
saving throw, except you make it as soon as you
reach the edge, not at the end of your turn.
Lower than 10: Failure. You fall over the edge.
10 or higher: Success. You fall prone at the edge,
in the last square you occupied before you would
have fallen. The forced movement ends.

Interesting things we learn everyday... But that's just falling over the edge... so going into fires don't count (looks at lui)

Squeeze
Half Speed: As part of the same move action, move
up to half your speed.

Ending Movement: You can end your movement
in an ally’s square only if the ally is prone. You can
end your movement in an enemy’s square only if the
enemy is helpless. However, Tiny creatures can end
their movement in a larger creature’s square. If you
don’t have enough movement remaining to reach a
square you are allowed to be in, your move ends in
the last square you could occupy.

Sad. No longer nearest adjacent square.

CONCEALMENT
✦ Melee Attacks and Ranged Attacks Only: Attack
penalties from concealment apply only to the targets
of melee or ranged attacks.

COVER
✦ Area Attacks and Close Attacks: When you make
an area attack or a close attack, a target has cover
if there is an obstruction between the origin square
and the target, not between you and the target.

✦ Creatures and Cover: When you make a ranged
attack against an enemy and other enemies are
in the way, your target has cover. Your allies never
grant cover to your enemies, and neither allies nor
enemies give cover against melee, close, or area
attacks
.

Hmmmmm.... So Close Burst, Burst and Blast are unaffected by concealment? Kinda makes sense actually..

Ongoing Damage
The Same Type of Ongoing Damage: If effects deal
ongoing damage of the same type, or if the damage
has no type, only the higher number applies.

Example:
You’re taking ongoing 5 damage (no type) when a
power causes you to take ongoing 10 damage. You’re
now taking ongoing 10 damage, not 15.

15 poison damage (save ends) is pain!


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2 A Note on Potions on Sat Feb 26, 2011 11:20 am

anand

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Hi guys,

I've been reading up on potions and consumables since our last meeting, and there is an interesting rule that I think we've overlooked. It's important, particularly because we've just picked up 3 potions of necrotic resistance.

Power(Consumable): Minor Action. Drink this potions and spend a healing surge. You do not gain hit points as normal. Instead gain resist 5 to damage of a specific type until the end of the encounter. The damage type (acid, cold, fire, lightning, necrotic, poison, psychic, or thunder) is determined when the potion is created. Only one potion of resistance can be in effect on you at once.

Just means we have to think before popping one of these babies.

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3 Combat Advantage on Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:27 pm

anand

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This came up during the last fight.




FLANKING


✦ Combat Advantage: You have combat advantage
(page 279) against an enemy you flank.

✦ Opposite Sides: To flank an enemy, you and an ally
must be adjacent to the enemy and on opposite
sides or corners of the enemy’s space.
When in doubt about whether two characters
flank an enemy, trace an imaginary line between the
centers of the characters’ squares. If the line passes
through opposite sides or corners of the enemy’s
space, the enemy is flanked.
✦ Must Be Able to Attack: You and your ally must
be able to attack the enemy, whether you’re armed
or unarmed. If there’s no line of effect between your
enemy and either you or your ally, you don’t flank. If
you’re affected by an effect that prevents you from
taking opportunity actions, you don’t flank.
✦ Large, Huge, and Gargantuan Creatures: If a
flanking creature’s space takes up more than 1
square, the creature gains combat advantage if any
square it occupies counts for flanking.




COMBAT ADVANTAGE

✦ +2 Bonus to Attack Rolls: You gain a +2 bonus to
your attack roll when you have combat advantage
against the target of your attack.
✦ Able to See Target: You must be able to see a
target to gain combat advantage against it.

The following situations give an attacker combat
advantage against a defender.
When a defender is . . .
Balancing (page 180)
Blinded (page 277)
Climbing (page 182)
Dazed (page 277)
Flanked by the attacker (page 285)
Helpless (page 277)
Prone (melee attacks only) (page 277)
Restrained (page 277)
Running (page 291)
Squeezing (page 292)
Stunned (page 277)
Surprised (page 277)
Unable to see the attacker (page 281)
Unaware of you (page 188)
Unconscious (page 277)




Based on the above rules on flanking and combat advantage, we can conclude that combat advantage confers the attack bonus to ALL attacks(melee or ranged), provided you are flanking the enemy. Although, granted, it is a little suicidal for a ranged character to risk an OA simply for a +2 to attacks.



Last edited by anand on Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:33 pm; edited 1 time in total

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4 Prone on Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:31 pm

anand

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Hi guys,

Can prone characters/creatures still make OAs?

I've skimmed through the .pdf for PHB and haven't found anything conclusive. Didn't bring Rules Compendium to KL, unfortunately.

The PHB Entry is:

Spoiler:
PRONE
✦ You grant combat advantage to enemies making
melee attacks against you.
✦ You get a +2 bonus to all defenses against ranged
attacks from nonadjacent enemies.
✦ You’re lying on the ground. (If you’re flying, you safely
descend a distance equal to your fly speed. If you
don’t reach the ground, you fall.)
✦ You take a –2 penalty to attack rolls.
✦ You can drop prone as a minor action.

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5 re : Prone on Sun Mar 13, 2011 8:02 am

I believe you can since it says '✦ You take a –2 penalty to attack rolls.'

Conditions for making an O.Att are that you must have line of sight to the enemy and you must be able to attack. Therefore, you can make an O.Att against an enemy that incurs one if you're prone (and not stunned/dazed/etc etc).

anand wrote:Hi guys,

Can prone characters/creatures still make OAs?

I've skimmed through the .pdf for PHB and haven't found anything conclusive. Didn't bring Rules Compendium to KL, unfortunately.

The PHB Entry is:

Spoiler:
PRONE
✦ You grant combat advantage to enemies making
melee attacks against you.
✦ You get a +2 bonus to all defenses against ranged
attacks from nonadjacent enemies.
✦ You’re lying on the ground. (If you’re flying, you safely
descend a distance equal to your fly speed. If you
don’t reach the ground, you fall.)
✦ You take a –2 penalty to attack rolls.
✦ You can drop prone as a minor action.

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6 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Mon Mar 14, 2011 2:28 am

Sounds correct

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7 Staff of Ruin + Dual Implement Spellcaster on Mon Jun 20, 2011 12:42 pm

Hi, as of the updates from March 2010 onwards, using a Staff of Ruin as an off-hand implement in conjunction with the Dual Implement Spellcaster feat does not add its bonus item damage to the main-hand attacks.

For sorcerers, it's best to use stuff that you don't have to attack with in the off-hand. Good candidates include: Defensive Staff (+1 to non-armor defenses), Rhythm Blade (+1 to AC and Reflex), and Quicksilver Blade (adds enhancement bonus to Initiative). If cost is an issue, a plain vanilla Magic Staff or Magic Dagger also works well.

And yes, this means Jagged / Staff of Ruin doesn't work the way some may hope that it does.. haha.

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8 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Mon Jun 20, 2011 12:55 pm

anand

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If that is the case, Lui holding a +3 Staff of Ruin and a +2 Staff of Ruin is quite redundant. Should I return his Defensive Staff +1 and put the +2 Staff of Ruin into Party Loot?

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9 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:16 pm

That would probably be best, yeah.

So, Lui's damage modifier is now:

Charisma +5
Dexterity +4
Staff of Ruin Enhancement Bonus +3
Staff of Ruin Item Bonus +3
Staff of Defense Enhancement Bonus +1
Weapon Focus +1

That makes it +17, which is still nothing to sniff at.

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10 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:27 pm

anand

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How come he adds Dex and Cha Mods to Damage Mods? Is that a Sorc feature?

and I'll reflect the changes in the party loot thread

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11 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Mon Jun 20, 2011 2:33 pm

Yeah, Sorcerers add two stats to arcane attacks; Wild/Storm adds Dexterity, while Cosmic/Dragon adds Strength.

That's basically their damage feature, like Sneak Attack, Hunter's Quarry, and Warlock's Curse. They generally have small and low numbers of damage dice, but benefit from high static modifiers, and they get to add their damage to all their targets - which is why I favor large multi-attack spells, cos I get to use my damage boost many times in the same attack.

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12 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Mon Jun 20, 2011 11:24 pm

Sorcs are the highest static damage strikers in DnD4e

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These things came up during last combat, so I thought I'll check the rules update and post what I found. Firstly, you have to choose your target before you charge; secondly, you not only have to be invisible, but also actually have to be hidden, in order to make your enemy play the 'guess-the-square' game.

To put it simply - when you use stealth, you become invisible and silent to your enemy. However, when you are invisible, you are not necessarily 'stealthed'.

Charging

✦ Target: When a creature takes this action, it chooses a target. Determine the distance between the creature and the target, even counting through squares of blocking terrain (Dungeon Master’s Guide, page 60), and then follow these steps.

✦ Move: The creature moves up to its speed toward the target. Each square of movement must bring the creature closer to the target, and the creature must end the move at least 2 squares away from its starting position.

✦ Attack: The creature either makes a melee basic attack against the target or uses bull rush against it. The creature gains a +1 bonus to the attack roll.

✦ No Further Actions: The creature can’t take any further actions during this turn, except free actions.

Invisible Creatures and Targeting


✦ Invisible Creatures and Stealth: If an invisible creature is hidden from you (“Stealth,” page 188), you can neither hear nor see it, and you have to guess what space it occupies. If an invisible creature is not hidden from you, you can hear it or sense some other sign of its presence and therefore know what space it occupies, although you still can’t see it.

✦ Make a Perception Check: On your turn, you can make a Perception check as a minor action (page 186) to try to determine the location of an invisible creature that is hidden from you.



Last edited by shao on Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:54 am; edited 1 time in total

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14 Weakened on Tue Jun 21, 2011 2:53 am


Also found this titbit in the update, that clarifies how the 'Weakened' status condition applies to damage types.

Weakened

✦ Your attacks deal half damage. However, two kinds of damage that you deal are not affected: ongoing damage and damage that isn’t generated by an attack roll.

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15 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:07 am

darthcow wrote:Sorcs are the highest static damage strikers in DnD4e

Oh, how I await Paragon with bated breath. Keyword hax FTW!

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16 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Fri Jun 24, 2011 12:23 am

Read the updated rules compendium found here. A few things of note:


Come And Get It only has one attack roll (Str vs. Will) to pull the target(s). Once the target is adjacent, it automatically takes 1[W] damage.

This helps our fighters (if Jo wants to remain a fighter, that is), as they don't have to make so many attack rolls. It does less damage now, though.



Also, one thing I never actually knew because I don't read this shit often enough.

Sneak Attack
Page 117: The feature now lets you deal extra damage ONCE PER TURN instead of once per round.

Like holy shit guys. This makes taking OAs (and being a Brutal Scoundrel) so much more worth it.

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17 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Fri Jun 24, 2011 7:15 pm

jo

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Come And Get It only has one attack roll (Str vs. Will) to pull the target(s). Once the target is adjacent, it automatically takes 1[W] damage.

This helps our fighters (if Jo wants to remain a fighter, that is), as they don't have to make so many attack rolls. It does less damage now, though.

huh
wait what now what
*runs around in circles*

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18 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:00 pm

Healer's Sash

Power (Daily ✦ Healing): Minor Action. You or an ally within 5 squares spends a healing surge but regains no hit points. You or one ally within 5 squares then regains hit points as though he or she had spent a healing surge.

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19 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Fri Jun 24, 2011 11:03 pm


huh
wait what now what
*runs around in circles*

Uh, relax la. It simply means you don't have to make two different successful attack rolls to pull and damage your enemies; if you hit, that means you manage to pull and damage them.

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20 Updated Version of Hospitaler's Blessing on Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:02 pm

From the Update pdf:

'Hospitaler's Blessing, Page 101: Replace “attacks one of your allies” with “makes an attack against one of your allies that does not include you.” The former text generates a disproportionate amount of healing, and it doesn’t give a monster a good way to use close or area attacks without healing its enemies.

Hospitaler’s Blessing (11th level): When an enemy that you currently challenge makes an attack against one of your allies that does not include you, whether the attack hits or misses, that ally regains hit points equal to one-half your level + your Wisdom modifier.'

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21 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:08 am

A few questions regarding our current houserules.

Our DM has ruled that creatures with reach can stop at a square adjacent to their target when making a charge attack. This differs from the standard rule that states a creature must stop at the closest square upon which it can make an attack. This benefits the DM's monsters mostly, as it gives creatures with reach more tactical options. It also benefits our dear Krum, assuming he remains a Stoneblessed (NONE IS BETTER AT CHARGING WITH REACH THAN KRUM!).

The question is: does this houserule also affect players that are using reach weapons? The reach provided by a polearm is not a natural ability of the player character, but a weapon property, as opposed to the natural reach most large monster have.


The second question is about the Urgrosh, which is a peculiar weapon. Errata puts the Urgrosh as a double weapon with two different weapon types on each side (one head is an axe, the other is a spear), and it is currently the only double weapon that has this oddity. The stat block for double weapons in the Errata PDF separates the two heads as if they were two different weapons that just happened to be joined at the haft (Siamese weapons). For instance, the Axe head is classified into the Axe group and the Spear head classified into the Spear group. This makes perfect sense, until you realize that the Axe head isn't classified into the Spear group (unlike a Halberd or a Glaive, which is both a Polearm and an Axe/Heavy Blade).

What I'm wondering is if taking a feat like Weapon Focus (Axe) gives me a damage bonus no matter which head I'm using, or if it only affects the Axe head. Would I have to get Weapon Focus (Spear) as well?

Furthermore, would feats such as Deadly Axe or Polearm Momentum only work with the respective heads? If I had Deadly Axe for instance, would only the Axe head get the high crit property?




Would like some clarification from anyone who might have an insight, or barring that, a ruling from our DM (putting it on the forums also makes it 'official').

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22 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Fri Jul 22, 2011 11:02 am

anand

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Zakmonster wrote:A few questions regarding our current houserules.

Our DM has ruled that creatures with reach can stop at a square adjacent to their target when making a charge attack. This differs from the standard rule that states a creature must stop at the closest square upon which it can make an attack. This benefits the DM's monsters mostly, as it gives creatures with reach more tactical options. It also benefits our dear Krum, assuming he remains a Stoneblessed (NONE IS BETTER AT CHARGING WITH REACH THAN KRUM!).

The question is: does this houserule also affect players that are using reach weapons? The reach provided by a polearm is not a natural ability of the player character, but a weapon

I may be wrong, but when I heard the veterans discussing it, the logic trail was something like this:

monsters can attack from 2 squares away
when i charge that statement still holds true
hence, 'the closest square upon which it can make an attack' is 2 squares away from the target

however, i think raihan's houseruling is to give him the option of basing the enemy, if needed. it seems rather inane to stop 1 square away from an artillery (unless he has weave through the fray)

i dont know if im actually correct on this, but thats what ive been thinking. dunno how the thing carries on to players

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23 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:26 pm

Hi Zaki,

Thanks for your question.

I am making a rules call that the "charge house rule" will only work for creature with natural reach.

The purpose of this "charge house rule" was to compensate the fact that large creatures find it near impossible to get cover with the other house rule in place.

I cannot find anything in the rules compendium or PHB about cover for large creatures in particular but I find that what Mark and Chien have proposed as "making sense".

The charge houserule gives some 'benefit' to being large despite the drawbacks regarding cover and difficult terrain vulnerability.

These calls are subject to review after some playtesting.

Regards,

Raihan

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24 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Sat Jul 23, 2011 4:35 am

Thanks for quick reply. I thought as much, I just wanted to double confirm before I locked myself into a weapon choice.

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25 Re: Rules. Retrospectively. on Mon Aug 29, 2011 8:41 am

Bringing up rules questions once again. This one is a pretty simple one, I swear. It concerns Twin Strike and the Marauder ranger.

Y'see, Twin Strike can be used with two melee weapons or a ranged weapon. That ranged weapon can be a bow, crossbow or a thrown weapon. All thrown weapons can also be used as a melee weapon. So assuming I am carry two thrown weapons (the drow long knife, in this instance), can I make one melee attack and one ranged attack with Twin Strike?

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